DIY Plus-NP?

[Mack75]

Hi all! Long time lurker here, but the first time I'm posting. Long story short: I run a mixed reef setup with 20+ years old live rock and my nutrients keep bottoming out, to the point where my pulsating Xenia has all but disappeared and GSP won't even open. SPS are growing fairly well, to the point that I'm able to trade or give away frags but leather corals aren't super happy and my zoas are very slow growers. I have a lot of fish (17 or 18 small fish in a 90 gallon Red Sea Reefer) and I suppose I could increase feedings even further, but I don't want to create a mess. Hanna meters tells me my nitrate is at 0,2 and phosphate at 0,0. Lately I've been dosing Plus-NP from Tropic Marin and quickly noticed some improvements, including very pronounced polyp extension and deeper colors in several SPS, but the bottle is very small, and I'm starting to wonder if there isn't some way to make a home made all in one nutrient solution?

 

[Pod_01]

Lately I've been dosing Plus-NP from Tropic Marin and quickly noticed some improvements, including very pronounced polyp extension and deeper colors in several SPS,

Nice feedback on the performance of Plus NP. I have the bottle but never had a chance to use it yet.

I don’t believe there is a direct home made recipe, TM Plus NP is using proprietary carbon source and the NP portion is as follows:

Plus-NP we use a linear polyphosphate and mainly reduced nitrogen compounds with a minor proportion of nitrate as ammonium nitrate.

I am not sure what the direct alternative is, or what the ratio is.
I believe something similar can be mixed.

Interesting question though…

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

Hi all! Long time lurker here, but the first time I'm posting. Long story short: I run a mixed reef setup with 20+ years old live rock and my nutrients keep bottoming out, to the point where my pulsating Xenia has all but disappeared and GSP won't even open. SPS are growing fairly well, to the point that I'm able to trade or give away frags but leather corals aren't super happy and my zoas are very slow growers. I have a lot of fish (17 or 18 small fish in a 90 gallon Red Sea Reefer) and I suppose I could increase feedings even further, but I don't want to create a mess. Hanna meters tells me my nitrate is at 0,2 and phosphate at 0,0. Lately I've been dosing Plus-NP from Tropic Marin and quickly noticed some improvements, including very pronounced polyp extension and deeper colors in several SPS, but the bottle is very small, and I'm starting to wonder if there isn't some way to make a home made all in one nutrient solution?

Welcome to being a Reef2Reef poster!

The plus NP is likely useful, and possibly even the best choice, but I don't like dosing unknown chemicals.

It is easy and desirable, in a situation like this to dose N and P, and I recommend food grade sodium phosphate and ammonium bicarbonate (although sodium or calcium nitrate can also be used).

DIY Ammonia dosing for low nitrate systems

Some reef aquaria have chronic low nitrogen availability. One indicator is very low nitrate. Nitrate dosing is a fine remedy, but it is possible that ammonia dosing may be more beneficial for some organisms since ammonia can be energetically easier to assimilate than is nitrate. For this...

www.reef2reef.com

 

[Mack75]

Welcome to being a Reef2Reef poster!

DIY Ammonia dosing for low nitrate systems

Some reef aquaria have chronic low nitrogen availability. One indicator is very low nitrate. Nitrate dosing is a fine remedy, but it is possible that ammonia dosing may be more beneficial for some organisms since ammonia can be energetically easier to assimilate than is nitrate. For this...

www.reef2reef.com

Thank you, and thank you I only have one spare head or channel on my dosing pump and was rather hoping to stumble across a foolproof recipe for a balanced additive. If not, I suppose I will have to keep buying Plus-NP

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

Thank you, and thank you I only have one spare head or channel on my dosing pump and was rather hoping to stumble across a foolproof recipe for a balanced additive. If not, I suppose I will have to keep buying Plus-NP

You can mix sodium phosphate and any of the N dosing solutions I mentioned into one solution (except calcium nitrate). :)

 

[Mack75]

You can mix sodium phosphate and any of the N dosing solutions I mentioned into one solution (except calcium nitrate). :)

Aha! So now I only have to work out the ratio! Thank you for your help :)

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

Aha! So now I only have to work out the ratio! Thank you for your help :)

You're welcome.

Depending on what else you dose, you may also be able to put those into those other solutions (such as the alk part of a two part).

 

[rishma]

Aha! So now I only have to work out the ratio! Thank you for your help :)

Working out the ratio is something I tinkered with but never completed because i eventually found that I didn’t need a constant dose of nitrogen or phosphate to keep things stable. My precisely dosed daily feedings accomplished the goal.

Before N&P stabilized, I would dose a target amount and then monitor the decline over a week or so, then try to dose ammonium bicarbonate and trisodium phosphate to match that decline. What I found was the dosing of ammonia increased phosphate consumption, so I had to increase my phosphate dose higher than the natural decline (without an ammonia dose). They were interdependent so it was complex. Hopefully that makes sense.

I never concluded the experiments but it’s interesting. Trial and error is a good approach in my opinion.

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

Working out the ratio is something I tinkered with but never completed because i eventually found that I didn’t need a constant dose of nitrogen or phosphate to keep things stable. My precisely dosed daily feedings accomplished the goal.

Before N&P stabilized, I would dose a target amount and then monitor the decline over a week or so, then try to dose ammonium bicarbonate and trisodium phosphate to match that decline. What I found was the dosing of ammonia increased phosphate consumption, so I had to increase my phosphate dose higher than the natural decline (without an ammonia dose). Hopefully that makes sense.

I never concluded the experiments but it’s interesting. Trial and error is a good approach in my opinion.

Trying to have a fixed ratio with any N and P product is also tricky if one does not start at the desired levels already, especially for phosphate, due to its binding to rock and sand. The ratio may change drastically as the tank levels stabilize at the desired target.

 

[Mack75]

Working out the ratio is something I tinkered with but never completed because i eventually found that I didn’t need a constant dose of nitrogen or phosphate to keep things stable. My precisely dosed daily feedings accomplished the goal.

Before N&P stabilized, I would dose a target amount and then monitor the decline over a week or so, then try to dose ammonium bicarbonate and trisodium phosphate to match that decline. What I found was the dosing of ammonia increased phosphate consumption, so I had to increase my phosphate dose higher than the natural decline (without an ammonia dose). They were interdependent so it was complex. Hopefully that makes sense.

I never concluded the experiments but it’s interesting. Trial and error is a good approach in my opinion.

I may be mistaken, but the way I understand it Plus-NP doesn't automatically translate into measurable phosphate and nitrate, administering instead readily available nitrogen and phosphorous to be dosed every day.

 

[rishma]

Trying to have a fixed ratio with any N and P product is also tricky if one does not start at the desired levels already, especially for phosphate, due to its binding to rock and sand. The ratio may change drastically as the tank levels stabilize at the desired target.

No disagreement. I started around the desired levels. Agree phosphate binding adds to the complexity

 

[rishma]

I may be mistaken, but the way I understand it Plus-NP doesn't automatically translate into measurable phosphate and nitrate, administering instead readily available nitrogen and phosphorous to be dosed every day.

I have used Plus NP and could see a nitrate and phosphate response. I would specifically use it if my phosphate dropped too low and it would help correct it.

It’s not my preferred method these days but I think it’s a good product.